Shabbat 149b (קמט:) — the Talmud in English

And according to Hillel’s statement,

they are also violating

the prohibition of

the prohibition of

interest.

For Hillel prohibited borrowing a loaf [unless they had assigned it a monetary value], because he was concerned that the price of wheat might rise. And if he repays him with a loaf, it turns out that he is repaying him more than the value of the loan. Thus, he comes to violate the prohibition of interest.

And since these people are particular with one another, if the item that he took becomes more expensive and he repays him according to its value at the time of repayment, he will violate the prohibition of interest.

But when they are not particular with one another, even when they pay more than the value of the loan, the borrower waives this amount for the lender, and there is no prohibition of interest in this case.

And although assigning a monetary value to the portions makes it permitted, members of a group should not participate at all. Since they are accustomed to one another, they will take from one another at every opportunity and will not remember to be precise and assign the portions a monetary value. [Tosafot, Bava Metzia 75].

And this is the reason for the Mishna’s ruling that one may draw lots at the table specifically with members of his household. For they are not particular with one another. But with others, since they are particular with one another, it is prohibited to divide the portions by lot. For this is like taking by measure, weight, or number. Each one transfers his share to the other, and in exchange the other repays him with another portion.

And we challenge this:

If so,

even

with his sons and members of his household as well

we should be concerned about the prohibition of measuring, counting, and weighing. And what is the difference between those who are particular with one another and those who are not? [For the prohibition of measuring and weighing applies even to people who are not particular with one another. And Shmuel said “those who are particular” only with regard to the fact that they may not participate in any manner, as explained by Tosafot.]

And we answer: With

his sons and members of his household, this is the reason

that we are not concerned about any of these prohibitions:

as

said

Rav Yehuda said in the name of Rav.

For Rav Yehuda said in the name of Rav: It is permitted to lend

from his own property

to his sons and members of his household

who are dependent on his table

with interest,

in order to give them a taste of interest. Since everything belongs to him, and even what they repay belongs to him, there is no interest here. He does this only so that they will know how onerous the payments of interest are.

Therefore, the prohibition against measuring, counting, and weighing on a Festival does not apply to them either. For this is neither a loan nor repayment. Everything belongs to him, and the fact that he is particular to divide it equally among them is only so that they will not be jealous of one another.

And we challenge this:

If so,

it should be permitted to draw lots with members of his household on Shabbat even for

a large portion against a small portion as well.

For below we explain that the reason for the prohibition is the prohibition against gambling. But according to what we have said—that with members of his household everything is permitted because everything belongs to him—let us say that the prohibition against gambling does not apply to them either, since he does this only to give them a mere taste of gambling. Why, then, did the tanna of the Mishna prohibit this?

And we answer:

Yes, indeed,

it is permitted to draw lots with members of his household even for a large portion against a small portion.

And

the Mishna

is incomplete, and this is what it teaches: A person may draw lots with his sons and members of his household

on Shabbat

at the table, and even a large portion against a small portion

is permitted.

What is the reason? —

As Rav Yehuda said in the name of Rav,

for it is not a genuine lottery, since everything belongs to him. There is neither the prohibition of a Festival loan nor that of gambling in this case.

Specifically,

with his sons and members of his household, he may not [draw lots]. But

with others he may not

draw lots on Shabbat.

Even if all the portions are equal.

What is the reason? —

As Rav Yehuda said in the name of Shmuel,

for whenever people are particular with one another, they violate through the lottery the prohibitions of measuring, weighing, and counting.

And for

a large portion against a small portion, even on a weekday,

to draw lots

for others

who are not members of his household

is prohibited.

What is the reason? —

Because of

the prohibition of gambling with

dice.

For it constitutes robbery. Since the loser does not wholeheartedly intend to transfer ownership to the winner, because this is an asmachta—a conditional commitment based on an assumption—and an asmachta does not effect acquisition. Everything that he initially agreed to was because he relied in his heart on winning the larger portion in the lottery. Therefore, he committed himself to the lottery and risked losing and receiving the smaller portion. Had he known initially that he would not win the larger portion, he would not have agreed to it.

We learned in the Mishna:

They cast lots

[for the portions]

for

the sacrificial portions on a Festival. But not for the portions.

And we inquire:

What is meant by “but not for the portions”?

Rabbi Yaakov, son of the daughter of Yaakov, said:

This is what it means: On a Festival, one may cast lots for portions of sacrificial meat from that same Festival. For it is a mitzva to hasten in eating sacrificial meat and to take a fine and large portion. [Maimonides, Commentary on the Mishna].

But one may not

cast lots

for portions of

sacrificial meat from

a previous day

from the day before

on a Festival,

since they could have drawn lots the day before.

And we challenge this: Since they are not sacrifices of the Festival,

it is obvious

that they do not override the prohibition of the Festival.

And we answer:

Lest you say, since

the priests are quarrelsome, as

it is written, “And your people are like those who quarrel with a priest,” [the verse compares the people of Israel to priests, who are quarrelsome], for this reason we might permit casting lots

even

for

portions of

sacrificial meat from

a previous day

on a Festival

as well,

so that they would not quarrel over them,

it teaches us

that they may not cast lots.

And Rabbi Yaakov, son of the daughter of Yaakov, said: Anyone

who

is punished by Heaven

through

him is not admitted into the precinct of the Holy One, blessed be He.

And we inquire:

From where do we know this?

If you say it is because it is written

in the prophecy of Micaiah concerning Ahab, king of Israel: “I saw the Lord sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven standing beside Him on His right and on His left.

And the Lord said, ‘Who will entice Ahab so that he will go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead?’ And one said this, and another said that” —

each member of the heavenly host proposed a different way to entice Ahab to wage war with the king of Aram at Ramoth-gilead.

Then the spirit went forth and stood before the Lord and said, ‘I will entice him,’

and the Lord said to him, “How?”

And he said, ‘I will go forth and be a spirit of falsehood in the mouth of all his prophets.’ And He said

[the Lord],

‘You will entice him, and you will prevail; go forth and do so.’

And we say: What is meant by “the spirit”?

And Rabbi Yohanan said: This was the spirit of Naboth,

whom Ahab killed and whose vineyard he inherited.

And what

is meant by what is

written, “Go forth

and do so”? —

Rav said:

The Lord said to Naboth’s spirit:

“Go forth from My presence.”

It is evident from this that since Ahab was punished through Naboth, Naboth departed from the presence of the Holy One, blessed be He.

And we reject this proof: If it is from there, it proves nothing, for

perhaps the reason there is

that he was commanded to leave the presence of the Holy One, blessed be He, because

he

proposed placing words of falsehood in the mouths of Ahab’s prophets. And

it is written, “One who speaks falsehood shall not be established

before My eyes.”

Rather, from here

we learn this statement of Rabbi Yaakov. For it is written in Habakkuk’s prophecy concerning Nebuchadnezzar:

“You are sated with disgrace instead of honor; drink also, and be uncircumcised

—the cup of the Lord’s right hand will come around to you, and disgrace will cover your glory.” And the verse proceeds to explain:

“You are sated with disgrace instead of honor” —

this refers to Nebuchadnezzar.

He would give kings wine to drink and intoxicate them, and then engage in male intercourse with them. On the day that he wished to engage in intercourse with Zedekiah, his foreskin extended three hundred cubits, as is brought below. This is the meaning of “you are sated with disgrace.”

And the plain meaning of the verse is this: You enjoyed and became sated from this disgrace more than you would have enjoyed the honor of victory in war.

“Drink also, and be uncircumcised” —

this refers to Zedekiah,

the king of Judah. He too was told that he would drink from the cup of retribution and would be uncircumcised in the sense of having a blocked heart and confused mind.

It is evident that since Nebuchadnezzar was punished through him [because he wished to engage in intercourse with him], Zedekiah too was punished. This accords with Rabbi Yaakov.

And we reject this: Nothing can be proven from there.

First,

because

the entire verse is written concerning Nebuchadnezzar,

and it is not speaking about Zedekiah. This is what it means: Drink also from the cup of retribution, as you caused them to drink, and become uncircumcised [that is, let your foreskin extend] and disgraced.

Furthermore,

it is not reasonable to interpret the verse as referring to Zedekiah. For

Zedekiah was righteous,

and

what could he have done to him

when Nebuchadnezzar forced him into male intercourse?

And we can also infer from Rav Yehuda that Zedekiah was righteous.

For Rav Yehuda said in the name of Rav: When that wicked man

[Nebuchadnezzar]

sought to do this to that righteous man

[Zedekiah], Nebuchadnezzar’s foreskin extended three hundred cubits. And it circled the entire banquet [the place where all the kings reclined before Nebuchadnezzar].

And we conclude:

Rather, from here

we derive this statement of Rabbi Yaakov. For it is written:

“It is also not good to punish the righteous.”

And

“not

good” means

“evil.”

From here we learn that a righteous person through whom another person is punished is called “evil.”

And it is written, “For You are not a God who desires wickedness; evil shall not dwell with You.” You are righteous, O Lord, and

evil

shall not dwell in Your presence. From here we learn that anyone through whom another person is punished and who is therefore called “evil” does not enter the presence of the Holy One, blessed be He.

We learned in the Mishna: And they cast lots for the sacrifices on a Festival.

And we inquire:

From where is it indicated that this word “lots

is an expression for a lottery

[a lot]

?

And we answer: We learn it from this,

as it is written

concerning Nebuchadnezzar:

“How you have fallen from heaven, shining one, son of the dawn! You have been cut down to the earth, you who cast lots over nations.”

And Rabba bar Rav Huna said:

Regarding what is written, “you who cast lots over nations,”

it teaches that he was

Nebuchadnezzar

casting lots among the nobles of the kingdom, to determine which of them

would be

his partner in male intercourse that day. Thus, “cast lots” is an expression for a lottery.

that day. Thus, “casting lots” is an expression for drawing lots.

And

with regard to what is

written

there:

“All the kings of the nations, all of them

lie in glory, each man in his own house” —

Rabbi Yohanan said:

After Nebuchadnezzar died,

all the kings

were relieved

of male intercourse

to which they had been subjected by Nebuchadnezzar during his lifetime.

And Rabbi Yohanan said: Throughout the lifetime of that wicked man

[Nebuchadnezzar],

no laughter was found in the mouth of any creature. As it is stated

in the prophecy concerning what occurred after his death:

“The whole earth is at rest and quiet; they break into song.”

By inference, until then there had been no song in the world.

And Rav Yitzhak said in the name of Rabbi Yohanan: It is prohibited to stand in the house of that wicked man. As it is stated

concerning his house:

“And goat-demons will dance there.”

If people were to come there, the harmful spirits would depart. They would thereby nullify the decree of the Omnipresent.

And Rav Yehuda said in the name of Rav: When that wicked man sought to do this to that righteous man

[to engage in male intercourse with Zedekiah],

Nebuchadnezzar’s foreskin extended three hundred cubits, and it circled the entire

banquet

[the place where all the kings reclined before him]

in its entirety. As it is stated, “You are sated with disgrace instead of honor; drink also, and be uncircumcised.”

And

“uncircumcised”

has the numerical value of three hundred.

And Rav Yehuda said in the name of Rav: When that wicked man descended to Gehinnom, all those who descend to Gehinnom trembled. They wondered and said: Perhaps he has come to rule over them, or perhaps he has come to suffer

in Gehinnom

like them?

As it is stated

in that same prophecy:

“You too have become weak like us; you have become like us.”

A Divine voice went forth and said: “From whom were you more pleasing? Descend and lie with the uncircumcised.”

You thought that you would be more pleasing than the others, but that will not be so. Rather, descend and lie in the grave with the other wicked, uncircumcised in heart.

It is written:

“How the oppressor has ceased, the exactor has ceased.”