Kiddushin 71b (עא:) — the Talmud in English

Rav Huna bar Taḥalifa said:

he explained

in the name of Rav: This is not difficult.

Here—

where an unspecified person is deemed unfit—this concerns

permitting him to marry a woman,

as an unspecified family in Eretz Yisrael is not permitted to enter the Jewish community without investigation.

And

here—

where an unspecified person is deemed fit—this concerns

taking a woman away from him.

Once he has already married a woman, we do not tell him to divorce her as long as he has not been investigated and found unfit.

Rav Yosef said: Anyone whose conversation is like that of Babylonians—

who speaks in the language of the people of Babylonia—

may be permitted to marry a woman

at the outset without investigation, because we presume that he belongs to the families of Babylonia, which have a presumption of fitness.

But nowadays,

now

there are deceivers

who teach the people of Eretz Yisrael the Babylonian language so that they will be presumed to be of distinguished lineage,

we are concerned

even with one whose conversation is like that of Babylonians, lest he belong to the families of Eretz Yisrael that require investigation.

Ze'iri was avoiding [

evading ]

Rabbi Yoḥanan,

because

Rabbi Yoḥanan would say to him:

Rabbi Yoḥanan:

Marry my daughter [

marry my daughter ]!

Ze'iri did not wish to marry her, because he belonged to the families of Babylonia, whereas Rabbi Yoḥanan belonged to the families of Eretz Yisrael, whose lineage was considered less distinguished.

One day, Rabbi Yoḥanan and Ze'iri were walking

Rabbi Yoḥanan and Ze'iri

along the road,

on the way.

They came to a water channel [

they reached a water channel ].

Ze'iri carried Rabbi Yoḥanan on his shoulders and carried him across [

Ze'iri placed him on his shoulders and carried him across ].

Rabbi Yoḥanan said to him:

You behave toward me like a disciple toward his teacher. But if

my Torah [

my Torah ]

is fit

in your eyes to learn from me, how can it be that

my daughters [

my daughters ]

are not fit

in your eyes to marry them?!

What is your reasoning,

why do you regard the families of Babylonia as being of more distinguished lineage?

Is it perhaps because of

the fact

that we learned: Ten classes of lineage ascended from Babylonia: priests, Levites

Israelites, ḥalalim, converts, and freed slaves—and you think that all the unfit people mentioned had ascended to Eretz Yisrael, so that none of them remained in Babylonia?!

That is not so. For

is it indeed the case that

all

the priests, Levites, and Israelites

mentioned in the Mishna

all ascended [

all ascended ] from Babylonia?! Surely some of the fit people remained in Babylonia, and they did not all ascend.

And

just as some of these remained,

the fit people,

some of these also remained

the unfit people; and if so, Babylonia does not have more distinguished lineage than Eretz Yisrael.

Rabbi Yoḥanan had forgotten [

it had escaped ] from Rabbi Yoḥanan

that which Rabbi Elazar said: Ezra did not ascend from Babylonia until he had made it like sifted flour, and then he ascended,

for he removed all the unfit people from it.

Ulla happened to come to Pumbedita, to the house of Rav Yehuda.

He saw [

he saw ]

Rav Yitzḥak, son of Rav Yehuda, who had grown up but had not married [

had matured but had not married ].

Ulla said to him

Ulla said to Rav Yehuda:

Why does my master not arrange a wife for his son [

why do you not marry off your son ]?!

He said to him

Rav Yehuda said:

Do I know from where I should marry

I do not know which woman has distinguished lineage and is suitable to marry to my son.

He said to him: Do we indeed know from where we come?!

Do we know the source of our own ancestry?!

Perhaps

we

are from

the descendants

of those

foreigners who violated Jewish women at the time of the destruction. As

it is written [

Lamentations 5:11 ]: “

Women were violated in Zion, virgins in the cities of Judah.”

And if you would say,

nevertheless we are fit, because our mothers were Jewish, and

a gentile or a slave who has intercourse with a Jewish woman,

and she conceives from him,

the child is fit!? —

—

Nevertheless, we must still be concerned that we are unfit, because

perhaps,

perhaps we

are from

the descendants

of those about whom it is written [

Amos 6:4 ]: “

Those who lie on beds of ivory and sprawl upon their couches”—

And Rabbi Yosei bar Ḥanina said

in explanation of this verse:

These

are

people who urinate in front of their beds

when they are

naked [

which is a disgraceful and foul practice: urinating on the ground near the bed and then continuing to sleep that way; this is the meaning of “sprawl” used by the verse ].

And Rabbi Abbahu rebuked [

objected to ]

him

for this interpretation and said:

If so,

if this is the meaning of the verse, it is difficult: What

is the meaning of that which is written

later in the verse, concerning the punishment of these people: “

Therefore they shall be the first to go into exile”?!

Will they be punished with such a severe punishment, that they will go into exile at the head of the exiles, merely because they urinate naked in front of their beds [which is only a disgraceful act]?!

Rather, Rabbi Abbahu said: These

are

people

who eat and drink with one another, join their beds together, exchange their wives with one another, and foul their couches with semen that is not their own

and consequently their children are mamzerim.

This is what Ulla said to Rav Yehuda: How do we know that we are not descended from those people, and that we are unfit by the law of a mamzer?

Rav Yehuda said to him:

If so,

what should I do?!

How can I select a woman of distinguished lineage for my son?

Ulla said to him:

Ulla said:

Follow silence.

Choose a quiet family, for its silence demonstrates its distinguished lineage.

Quarrelsome and contentious people are suspect of being unfit. Since the community separated itself from them because of their unfitness, they became accustomed to harboring resentment and maintaining disputes with the community.

As in the practice by which the people of the West investigated [

as the people of Eretz Yisrael investigated ],

when two people quarreled with one another [

when two people fought ],

they would see which of them was the first to remain silent [

they would see which was first to stop arguing ], and

they would say: This one has more distinguished lineage!

Rav said: The silence of Babylonia—that is its distinguished lineage!

There is no need to investigate a person’s lineage; it is sufficient to determine whether he is quiet, and through this he is deemed to have distinguished lineage.

And we challenge this:

Is that so? And

surely this is not the case, for

Rav once happened to come to the house of Bar Shafi Ḥala [

he happened to come to the house of a man who sold vinegar ],

and he investigated them

regarding the fitness of their family.

Is it not

that Rav investigated their fitness

through their lineage

and did not rely on their silence?

And we reject this:

No,

that is not what happened; rather, he investigated

through their silence.

And

this is what he said to them: Investigate whether they are silent or not silent.

And he established their lineage on that basis.

Rav Yehuda said in the name of Rav: If you see two people provoking one another, there is a trace of unfitness in one of them!

And

therefore they quarrel with one another, because

Heaven does not allow him

from Heaven

to cleave to the other,

and therefore Heaven brought about a quarrel between them.

Rabbi Yehoshua ben Levi said: If you see two families provoking one another, there is a trace of unfitness in one of them.

And

therefore there is a quarrel between them, because

Heaven does not allow it

from Heaven

to cleave to the other family.

Rav Pappa the Elder said in the name of Rav:

Babylonia—

healthy

it is, possessing distinguished lineage and free of unfit people. “

Mishon”

is a place of

death,

for all its inhabitants are complete mamzerim.

Media—

ill

it is: neither healthy nor dead, but most of its inhabitants are fit and a minority are unfit, like sick people, most of whom recover and a minority of whom die.

Elam—

dying!

Like people on the verge of death, most of whom die and a minority of whom live, so most of its inhabitants are unfit and a minority are fit.

He therefore calls Media “ill” and Elam “dying,” since

what is the difference between the sick and those on the verge of death?—

Most sick people live,

and so it is with Media, most of whose inhabitants are fit.

And

most people on the verge of death die,

and so it is with Elam, most of whose inhabitants are unfit.

We learned in the Mishna: Eretz Yisrael is like dough mixed with leaven in relation to Babylonia.

And the Gemara asks:

How far does Babylonia extend,

with regard to lineage?

The discussion before us is explained according to the method of Tosafot.

Two great rivers flow through Babylonia, the Euphrates and the Tigris, and they flow from north to south. The Euphrates is on the western side of Babylonia, while the Tigris is on its eastern side. The two rivers draw close to one another farther south, on the southern side of Babylonia, and eventually unite into a single river.

All the land between the Euphrates and the Tigris is certainly considered the land of Babylonia with regard to lineage.

The issue discussed by the Gemara is how far the width of Babylonia extends beyond the bank of the Tigris, outward toward the east [with regard to lineage].

Rav said: As far as the Azak River,

which is located to the east of the Tigris; the width of Babylonia extends that far.

And Shmuel said: As far as the Yo'ani River.

These are the eastern and western boundaries of Babylonia [that is, all the area between the Euphrates and the Tigris, as well as the area east of the Tigris as far as the Azak River according to Rav, or as far as the Yo'ani River according to Shmuel].

The Gemara now discusses where the northern and southern boundaries of Babylonia lie with regard to lineage.

First, the Gemara discusses where the northern boundary of Babylonia lies:

Above,

higher up,

along the Tigris [

the Tigris ],

how far?!

How far does Babylonia extend northward, along the upper course of the Tigris?

Rav said: As far as Bagda and Awana,

which are neighboring places, with the Tigris separating them.

That is the northeastern corner of Babylonia with regard to lineage.

And Shmuel said: As far as Mushkanei,

Babylonia extends northward,

but Mushkanei itself is not included.

Mushkanei itself is no longer considered part of Babylonia with regard to lineage.

And we challenge this:

But Rabbi Ḥiyya bar Abba said in the name of Shmuel: Mushkanei is considered

to be

as

equivalent in importance to

the Exile

with regard to lineage.

“The Exile” refers to Pumbedita, and this proves that Mushkanei too is within the boundaries of Babylonia.

And we conclude:

Rather,

this is what Shmuel said:

As far as Mushkanei, and

even

Mushkanei is included

within Babylonia.

The Gemara now explains the southeastern corner of Babylonia with regard to lineage:

Below,

farther down,

along the Tigris,

the Tigris,

how far?!

How far does Babylonia extend along the lower course of the Tigris, which is on the southern side?

Rav Shmuel said: As far as Lower Aphumya [

Lower Aphumya ], but not including it.

For

there are two Aphumyas, one Upper and one Lower [

one higher and one lower ].

One [

the upper one ]

is fit

with regard to lineage, because it is still part of Babylonia.

And one [

the lower one ]

is unfit,

because it is already outside the boundaries of Babylonia.

And between one

Aphumya

and the other [

its counterpart ] there is a distance of

a parasang.

And they are particular with one another, and they do not even lend one another fire [

the inhabitants of the fit place are careful not to approach those of the unfit place, and they do not even lend one another fire ], so that they will not become accustomed to associating with them and come to marry one another.

And this is your sign,

this sign will enable you to know which is fit and which is unfit:

The unfit one is the one that speaks the language of Mishon.

The unfit one is the place that speaks in the language of “Mishon,” because it is closer to it. And we already learned above: Mishon is dead [unfit].

The Gemara now discusses where the northwestern corner of Babylonia lies:

Above,

higher up,

along the Euphrates—

how far?

How far northward, along the upper course of the Euphrates, does the northern boundary of Babylonia extend?

Rav said: As far as the fort of Tulbaknei.

And Shmuel said: As far as the bridge of the house of the Euphrates,

the bridge over the Euphrates. That is, Shmuel extended the boundary farther north.

And Rabbi Yoḥanan said: As far as the crossing of Gizma.

Abaye cursed [

he cursed ]

and some say, Rav Yosef

cursed anyone who relied with regard to the lineage of Babylonia

on Rav [

on Rav’s statement ], because they held that the boundary of Babylonia did not extend so far and that the entire area mentioned was not included in Babylonia’s status of distinguished lineage.

And we wonder: Did Abaye curse only one who relied

on Rav,

while one who relied

on Shmuel was not cursed?!

Surely Shmuel extended the territory of Babylonia farther north.

And we answer:

Rather, he cursed

Abaye even one who relied

on Rav, and all the more so

he cursed one who relied

on Shmuel.

And if you wish, say: Actually,

only one who relied

on Rav was cursed,

while one who relied

on Shmuel was not cursed.

This is because, on the northwestern side, Shmuel reduced the extent of Babylonia. For

the bridge of the house of the Euphrates,

the place of the bridge over the Euphrates, which according to Shmuel was the northwestern boundary,

was situated below it [

below, north of Rav’s boundary, within the country ]

in his time,

it stood there in Shmuel’s days, whereas later they built it farther north; Shmuel was referring to the bridge that existed in his time.