Taanit 10a (י.) — the Talmud in English

The Gemara explains:

That

that verse is not speaking at all about the descent of rain, but

about the creation

of the world,

of the world

it is speaking.

At first, the entire world was inundated with water, and the Holy One, blessed be He, gathered the waters into one place, like one who puts water into a leather flask.

And this is the meaning of “He gathered like a mound the waters of the sea”: He gathered them as one puts water into a nad. “He placed them in storehouses of the deep”: He placed them in storehouses [as it says later in the verse: “There He set its boundary, and its storehouse for the sea”].

The Sages taught: The Land of Israel was created first

, and the entire world was created last,

after the Land of Israel.

As it is stated

in the Book of Proverbs, in the verses dealing with the creation of the world:

“Before He had made the land and the open spaces.”

“Land” means the Land of Israel.

“Open spaces” means outside the Land of Israel.

The Land of Israel—

the Holy One, blessed be He, waters it Himself.

But

the

entire world—

He waters it

through an agent.

As it is stated: “Who gives rain upon the face of the land, and sends water upon the face of the open spaces.”

That is, upon the face of the Land of Israel—“who gives rain”: the Holy One, blessed be He, gives it Himself. But upon the face of the open spaces, meaning the lands of the rest of the world—“and sends water”: through an agent.

The Land of Israel drinks rainwater, whereas the entire world

drinks

from its residue.

That is, from what remains in the clouds after the Land of Israel has drunk.

As it is stated: “Who gives rain upon the face of the land, etc.”

The Land of Israel drinks first,

for rain descends there first.

And the entire world—

last.

As it is stated: “Who gives rain upon the face of the land, etc.”

This is analogous to a person who curdles cheese

[who prepares cheese]. How does he do it?

He takes the edible portion and leaves the waste

[he takes the cheese from the vessel in which he left the milk to curdle, and leaves the whey there]. So too here: The Land of Israel takes the principal portion of the rain, while the remaining rain, the waste, descends upon the rest of the world.

The Master said

[we brought above the statement of Rabbi Eliezer]: The waters of the ocean

are sweetened in the clouds.

The Gemara asks:

From where does he derive it

[from where does Rabbi Eliezer derive this—that the world drinks from the waters of the ocean, and those waters rise and are sweetened in the clouds]?

The Gemara explains:

For Rabbi Yitzḥak bar Yosef said that Rabbi Yoḥanan said: It is written

in the Book of Psalms:

“He darkens the waters, the thick clouds of the skies,” and it is written

in a similar verse in the Book of Samuel:

“The sieving of water, the thick clouds of the skies.”

Thus, we have two verses dealing with the descent of rain: in one verse we find the expression “darkens,” and in the other we find “sieving.”

Take

[remove] the letter

kaf

from the word “darkens” mentioned in the first verse,

and cast

[insert and combine it]

with the resh

[with the letter resh] of the word “sieving” mentioned in the second verse,

and read it

[read it in the resulting word] as

“fit to be sweetened.”

That is, the waters of the ocean, which are initially salty, are sweetened and made fit in the clouds.

The Gemara asks:

And Rabbi Yehoshua,

who holds that the world drinks from the upper waters,

with these verses

[the verses mentioned above, “He darkens the waters” and “The sieving of water”]

what does he expound from them

[what does he derive from them]? According to his view, the waters are not sweetened in the clouds!

The Gemara explains:

He agrees with this

[he holds in accordance with the following].

For when Rav Dimi came, he said: In the West they say

[when Rav Dimi came from the Land of Israel to Babylonia, he said that this is what they say in the Land of Israel]:

When the cloud is bright

[when the cloud is thin and bright]—

its waters are scant

[its waters are few and slight].

But when

the cloud is dark

[the cloud is dark and dense]—

its waters are abundant

[it contains much water].

This is the meaning of “He darkens the waters”: when the clouds are dark, their waters are abundant. It follows that when the clouds are thin and bright, their waters are few. And “sieving” is an expression of causing to drip.

The Gemara asks:

In accordance with whom,

according to whose view,

does the following beraita proceed

[does the following beraita accord]:

The upper waters

are not resting upon anything; rather, they are gathered and stand like a pool, and

by the utterance

of the Holy One, blessed be He,

they are suspended

[that is, the waters remain suspended and standing, and do not descend or fall upon the earth because of the utterance of the Holy One, blessed be He, who told them to remain so].

And their fruits

of those waters are

rainwater.

That is, the upper waters are not diminished at all when rain descends; rather, rain is like the fruit of a tree, which does not diminish anything from the tree.

And from where do we learn this?

As it is stated: “From the fruit of Your deeds the earth is satisfied.”

That is, rain is the fruit of the deeds of the Holy One, blessed be He, and through it the earth is satisfied. Since rain is called “fruit,” it follows that it does not diminish the upper waters at all.

In accordance with whom

[according to whose view does this beraita proceed]—

The Gemara says: The beraita is explained

according to

the view of

Rabbi Yehoshua,

who holds that the world drinks from the upper waters.

The Gemara asks:

And Rabbi Eliezer,

how will he explain the verse, “From the fruit of Your deeds the earth is satisfied”?

The Gemara explains: Rabbi Eliezer will say that

that

verse

is written concerning the work of the hands of the Holy One, blessed be He—

it is speaking

[about that]. The verse is thus explained: From the fruit of the work of Your hands, the earth will be satisfied. That is, You created the waters so that the earth would be satisfied by them.

Rabbi Yehoshua ben Levi said: The entire world—

it drinks from the residue of the Garden of Eden.

As it is stated: “And a river issues from Eden, etc.”

[the end of the verse is: “to water the garden”].

A tanna taught:

Just as

from the residue

[residue means what remains clinging to the sides of a vessel after its contents have been poured out] of a vessel from which one waters a field whose area is

a beit kor—

it can water

land measuring

a tarkav,

half a se’a, which is one-sixtieth of a beit kor [for a kor contains thirty se’a]. Thus, residue can water one-sixtieth of the area that could have been watered by all that the vessel contained—

so too the entire world, which is one-sixtieth of the Garden of Eden, suffices with the residue of the clouds that water the garden.

The Sages taught: The land of Egypt is

[it is] an area of

four hundred parasangs

by four hundred parasangs.

And it

is a

one-sixtieth part of the land of

land of

Cush.

That is, the land of Cush is sixty times larger than the land of Egypt.

And

the land of

Cush—

a

one-sixtieth part of the world.

The entire world is sixty times larger than the land of Cush.

And the world—

it is one-sixtieth of the Garden

of Eden.

And the Garden—

one-sixtieth of Eden.

And Eden—

one-sixtieth of Gehenna.

It follows

that

the entire world—

is like the lid of a pot in relation to Gehenna

[with regard to Gehenna]. That is, the ratio between the world and Gehenna in terms of size resembles the ratio between a pot’s lid and the pot itself. Just as the pot is far larger than its lid, so Gehenna is far larger than the entire world.

And some say: Gehenna has no measure

at all.

And some say: Eden has no measure.

Rabbi Oshaya said: What is the meaning of the verse

[what is the explanation of the verse] said concerning Babylonia:

“She dwells upon abundant waters, rich in treasures”?

What caused Babylonia’s storehouses to be full of grain—

you must say: because

it

dwells upon abundant waters.

Since Babylonia is lower than all the lands, much rainwater flows down there and irrigates its fields.

Rav said: Babylonia is wealthy,

[Babylonia is rich],

for it harvests without rain

[grain is harvested there without rain], because it does not need rain.

Abaye said: We hold

[we maintain] that Babylonia harvests without rain because it is a

waterlogged

[low-lying, marshy] place; that is, its soil is wet and moist,

and not arid

[it is not a dry place].

Mishna:

Until now we have discussed the time when the mention of rain begins, with the recitation of “Who makes the wind blow and the rain fall.” The Mishna now discusses when one begins requesting rain, with the recitation of “Grant dew and rain.”

On the third of

the month of

Marheshvan—

one begins requesting rain,

even though the proper time for rain to fall is actually from Shemini Atzeret .

Rabban Gamliel says: On the seventh of it,

the month of Marheshvan, which is

fifteen days after the Festival [the Festival of Sukkot], one begins requesting rain.

fifteen days after the Festival [the Festival of Sukkot], one begins requesting rain.

And the reason is

so that the last

of the pilgrims

of Israel

would reach

his home in the region of

the Euphrates River,

which is the edge of Eretz Yisrael , before the rain fell. And since the people of Israel remain in Jerusalem throughout the pilgrimage , and set out on their return journey at its conclusion, while the journey to the Euphrates River lasts at most fifteen days , they therefore begin requesting rain only on the seventh of Marheshvan.

Gemara:

Rabbi Elazar said: The halakha is in accordance with Rabban Gamliel,

who says that rain is requested on the seventh of the month of Marheshvan .

It was taught in a baraita: Hanania says: And in the Diaspora

rain is not requested until

sixty

days into the season

[until the sixtieth day of the season of Tishrei ]. The reason is that the region is low-lying, and its inhabitants do not need as much rain, because water reaches it from other, higher places.

Rav Huna bar Hiyya said that Shmuel said: The halakha

is in accordance with Hanania .

And Rav likewise holds this, for he says that the sixtieth day is considered like the time after sixty. The expression "

The Gemara objects:

Is that so?

Is this indeed the case?

But they asked Shmuel

[the following question]:

From when do we mention

[from when does one begin mentioning and reciting in the prayer]

“Grant dew and rain”?

And

he said to them

[and Shmuel said to them]: The time is

from when the household of Tavot, the bird hunter, bring firewood into the storehouse

[from the time that the members of Tavot’s household, who was a bird hunter , bring wood into the storehouse for the rainy season. This is a sign that the time for rain has arrived: Tavot’s household knew that from then onward they would no longer be able to chop wood in the forest, and therefore hurried to bring wood into the storehouse]! Here we see that they begin reciting “Grant dew and rain” at a different time!

The Gemara says: What is the difficulty?

Perhaps both this and that—

are one measure

[perhaps these two times—the sixtieth day of the season and the time when the wood is brought into the storehouse—are the same time].

They raised a question

[a question was raised in the study hall]: We brought the statement of Hanania that in the Diaspora rain is not requested until the sixtieth day of the season. The issue is:

The sixtieth day

itself—is it

like

the days

before sixty

and one does not recite “Grant dew and rain” on it,

or

perhaps is it

like

the days

after sixty

and one does recite “Grant dew and rain” on it?

Come and hear: Rav said: The sixtieth day

itself

is like the time after sixty

and one recites “Grant dew and rain” on it.

And Shmuel said: The sixtieth day—

"

is like the time before sixty

and one does not recite “Grant dew and rain” on it.

Rav Naḥman bar Yitzḥak said: And your mnemonic is

this: Keep this sign in mind so that you will not err in this dispute—who said that the sixtieth day is like the time before sixty, and who said that it is like the time after sixty:

Those above need water

[those who live in the mountains need more water, because the rainwater flows down the slope].

Those below do not need water

[those who live in the valley do not need much rain, because all the water that descends from the mountains gathers in the valley].

Therefore, Rav, who lived in Eretz Yisrael, which is higher than all other lands ] and needs abundant rain, said that the sixtieth day is like the time after sixty, so that rain would be requested as early as possible .

But Shmuel, who lived in Babylonia, which is a valley and does not need much rain, said that the sixtieth day is like the time before sixty, and rain is not requested on it .

Rav Pappa said: The halakha

[the practical ruling] is:

The sixtieth day—

is like the time after sixty ,

,

and rain is requested on it, in accordance with Rav.

Mishna:

A. If the days appropriate for the falling of rain had begun [that is, from the third of Marheshvan or from the seventh of that month, as we learned in the previous Mishna], and

the

day

seventeen of

the month of

Marheshvan had already arrived -

The commentators wrote that this is in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Meir, who said that the time of the first rainfall is on the third, the intermediate rainfall on the seventh, and the late rainfall on the seventeenth. As the Gemara cited above, the practical difference for us regarding the third rainfall concerns the fast. But according to the opinion of Rabbi Yosei, this does not work. -

and

still

no rain has fallen,

they begin

the individuals

[that is, Torah scholars distinguished by their deeds ]

to observe three fasts,

in order to arouse mercy so that rain will fall . [The Gemara below will explain on which days they fast].

These fasts are not stringent. Therefore,

they may eat and drink once it grows dark

[that is, once the day has grown dark on the evening before the fast and the night of the fast has begun, they are still permitted to eat and drink. They begin fasting only at the beginning of the day] .

And

likewise, on those fast days,

they are permitted to engage in

the performance of

labor, bathing, anointing

[applying an oily substance to the body],

wearing leather footwear

made of leather,

and marital relations.

b.

When the new moon of Kislev arrived

, and

still

no rain had fallen, the court decreed three fasts upon

the entire

community.

These fast days as well, which the court decreed upon the entire community, are not stringent. Therefore,

they eat and drink from nightfall, and they are permitted to engage in labor, bathing, anointing, wearing leather footwear, and marital relations.

Gemara:

Who are

[who are] these

“individuals”?

Rav Huna said: The Sages

[Torah scholars] .

And Rav Huna said: Individuals fast three fasts,

on the days

Monday, Thursday, and Monday.

The Gemara asks:

What is he teaching us

[what did Rav Huna teach us by saying that they fast on Monday, Thursday, and Monday]?

After all,

we already learned

[we learned this matter in the Mishna below]:

They do not initially decree a fast upon the community on

the day of

Thursday

[they do not begin the fast days on Thursday]—in order

not to drive up prices.

That is, if they begin fasting on Thursday, they will need to purchase two large meals at the conclusion of the fast: one for ending the fast and one for Shabbat. Consequently, the sellers will think that famine has come to the world, and they will drive up prices .

Rather,

this is the order of

the first three fasts:

they begin fasting on

Monday, and

they fast again on

Thursday, and

they fast once more on

Monday

of the following week!

The Gemara answers: Rav Huna needed to state his ruling because

lest you say

[perhaps you would say]: What we learned, that they fast specifically on Monday, Thursday, and Monday,

this applies only

[that is, specifically] to a fast on which the entire

community fasts,

when there is concern that prices will be driven up.

But

with regard to a

fast of an individual,

when the individuals fast before the communal fast—

no,

he teaches us

[he taught us]

Rav Huna

that even in the case of an individual, the order of the fasts is Monday, Thursday, and Monday.

This was also taught in a beraita

[we likewise find this in a beraita]:

When the individuals began fasting, they fast on Monday, Thursday, and Monday.

Thus, we learn that the individuals, too, do not begin fasting on Thursday.