Nedarim 61b — the Talmud in English

And we raise an objection:

Does this mean

and was it said]

that Rabbi Meir holds: a person does not bring himself into uncertainty? ![](pamud.bmp "

exact page location")

into uncertainty

a person does not bring himself into a state of uncertainty], and therefore, although “before Passover” can be interpreted as until the final moment before the end of Passover, since it is not clear that this is the meaning of his speech, and this time of Passover is uncertain, a person does not create for himself a state of uncertainty; and we assume that his intention in taking a vow is only according to the certain meaning of the words, and therefore he is forbidden only until Passover.

And Rabbi Yosei holds: a person does bring himself into uncertainty

a person creates for himself a state of uncertainty], and since it is possible that the meaning of his words is until the final moment of Passover, he is therefore forbidden, because of the uncertainty, until this time.

And is this indeed their position!?

And we raise a contradiction

from this, from what we learned in tractate Kiddushin [51b]:

One who has two groups of daughters from two wives,

from each of his two wives he has an elder daughter and a younger daughter.

For example, he had two wives, one Rachel and the other Leah.

And Rachel his wife had two daughters: Bilhah the elder, and Zilpah the younger.

And Leah his wife also had two daughters: Dinah the elder, and Asenath the younger.

And Bilhah was older than Dinah, Dinah older than Zilpah, and Zilpah older than Asenath.

And he said,

the father, at the time that he betrothed his daughter, to the man betrothing her: “

I betrothed

to you

my elder daughter.”

And I do not know,

it is not known how to interpret his words:

If

the intention is only for the daughter

who is elder among

the two

elders

from the two women, namely: Bilhah.

Or

if

the intention is for the

elder among

the two

younger ones,

from the two women, namely Zilpah.

And if,

or the intention is for the

younger among the elders

from the two women, namely Dinah,

who is

the

older than the elder among the younger ones,

namely Zilpah.

Thus

all of them—

Bilhah, Zilpah, and Dinah—

are forbidden,

since all of them are included in the uncertainty, as was explained.

Except for the younger among the younger ones,

namely Asenath, who certainly cannot be called “elder” and is not included in the uncertainty,

the words of Rabbi Meir.

Rabbi Yosei says: All of them are permitted, except for the elder among the elders.

Namely, Bilhah.

And the reason is that a person does not wish to bring his daughters into a state of uncertainty, and he certainly intended the elder among the elders.

It follows that Rabbi Meir and Rabbi Yosei disagree about this matter, and their positions are the reverse of what they are in our Mishna!?

Rav Hanina bar Avdimi said in the name of Rav: The position is reversed

in our Mishna, and the words of Rabbi Meir must be attributed to Rabbi Yosei, and the words of Rabbi Yosei to Rabbi Meir.

And the Gemara supports the answer:

And it was taught

[agreeably]:

This is the general rule: Anything whose time is fixed

[whose duration is fixed]

and he said “

until before”:

Rabbi Meir says: until it ends,

because a person brings himself into uncertainty

; and Rabbi Yosei says: until it arrives,

because a person does not bring himself into uncertainty.

Mishna:

One who said: “Konam, wine that I taste,” “

until the harvest”

of wheat, or “

until the vintage”

of grapes, or “

until the olive harvest”

of olives—

then he

is forbidden only until it arrives,

the harvest, vintage, or olive harvest.

This is the general rule:

Anything whose time is fixed,

that is, “whose duration is fixed,” such as Passover, which lasts seven days and no longer,

and he said,

that is, only then is there a distinction between the expressions, so that if he said: “

Until it arrives”

he is forbidden

he

until it arrives,

and if he said “

until it will be,”

then he

is forbidden until it ends.

And anything whose

[duration]

time is not fixed,

such as harvest and vintage, whose duration is not fixed, that they last that length of time and no longer,

whether he said “

until it will be”

and

whether he said “

until it arrives,”

then he

is forbidden only until it arrives,

for a person does not prohibit himself for an unbounded period.

One who said “ until the summer”

[the time for gathering fig fruits] “or he said: ‘

until it will be summer’,”

then he is forbidden

until the people begin to bring in their baskets

[baskets for gathering figs],

because its duration is not fixed, and his intention is to say: “until it arrives.”

And if he said: “

until summer passes,”

then he is forbidden

until the knives are folded

[knives designated for cutting figs when making fig cakes from them], that is, when they fold up their knives and stop cutting.

Gemara:

We learned in the Mishna: “Until summer, until it will be summer, until people begin to bring them in baskets”:

A tanna

in a beraita, to explain the Mishna: “

Basket”

that they said

in our Mishna means

a basket of figs and not a basket of grapes,

because “summer” indicates fruits that are “cut” by hand, whereas grapes are “cut” with a knife and are not “cut” by hand.

It was taught:

One who vows regarding the fruits of “

summer,”

that is, fruits that are cut,

is forbidden only with figs,

as the Gemara explains the reason and proceeds.

Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel says:

Even

grapes

are included with figs,

that is, grapes, like figs, are included among “summer” fruits.

And we explain:

What is the reason of the first tanna?

Because

he holds: figs are cut by hand

[they are cut by hand], and therefore they are included among “summer” fruits, but

grapes

these

are not cut by hand

but with a knife, and therefore they are not included among “summer” fruits.

Whereas

Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel holds: grapes also,

indeed

when their stalks dry

[when the stalks of the grapes have dried],

are cut by hand,

and therefore they too are included among “summer” fruits.

We learned in the Mishna:

“Until summer passes, until the knives are folded”:

A tanna

in a beraita:

until most of the knives are folded.

“Until they fold up most of the knives.”