Kiddushin 70b — the Talmud in English

One does not ask after the welfare of a woman,

for perhaps, through asking after her welfare, they will become accustomed to one another and come to affection. And even through an agent there is this concern.

He said to him

Rav Nahman: But is it not possible to send her greetings

through her husband,

that is, I will be an agent in the matter, and in such a manner there is no concern of affection.

Rav Yehuda

said to him:

This is what Shmuel said: One does not ask after the welfare of a woman at all,

because this accustoms her heart and mind to him.

Yalta

sent to him,

his wife,

[the wife of Rav Nahman, upon hearing the exchange between them]:

Release his litigation

[fulfill his request quickly and dismiss him from before you], so that

he not make you

[that he should not make you]

like any other ignoramus!

Rav Nahman said to

Rav Yehuda:

What is my master’s business here?

[What is my master’s way here? “Shiyata” is from the language of way, like “to travel through the land.”] That is, why did you come here?

Rav Yehuda

said to him:

My master sent a summons-document after me

[my master sent me a document summoning me to judgment]!

Rav Nahman said to him: Now, I have not learned my master’s speech,

and would I

send my master a summons-document?!

After all, I do not even understand my master’s conversation; would I send you a summons to judgment?

Rav Yehuda took out

Rav Yehuda

the summons-document from the bosom of his garment, and showed it to him

[he took the summons-document out of his bosom and showed it to Rav Nahman]. And

he said to him: Here is the man, and here is the document

[here is my master signed on the summons-document]!

He said to him

Rav Nahman: Although I am not fit to judge you, nevertheless,

since

already

my master has come here, let him state his matter

[let my master state his claim], and establish his own merit,

so that people not say

people:

Sages flatter one another!

For if I dismiss you without anything, people will say that sages flatter one another and do not judge them according to Torah law like the rest of Israel.

Rav Nahman entered into judgment with him, and

he said to him: For what reason did my master excommunicate that man

who called you “son of a dice-player”?

Rav Yehuda said to him: Because he

caused distress to

my attendant, who is

an agent of the Sages.

Rav Nahman said to him:

And my master should have flogged him!

After all, you should have punished him with lashes and not excommunicated him.

For Rav administers lashes

[he flogged]

to one who causes distress to an agent of the Sages.

Rav Yehuda said to him: A punishment

more severe than it

[than lashes]

I performed for him,

I did this to him, for excommunication is more severe than lashes.

Rav Nahman again asked him:

For what reason did my master publicly declare concerning

that man,

that he is a slave?!

Rav Yehuda

said to him: Because

he is accustomed

this man

to call

[to read]

people “

my slaves.”

And it was taught,

and we already learned:

Anyone who disqualifies

others is himself

disqualified.

And

a disqualified person

never speaks in praise

of others

ever,

but speaks of their disgrace.

And Shmuel said:

Anyone who disqualifies

disqualifies through his own blemish!

And since he was accustomed to calling people “my slaves,” this is proof that he himself is a slave.

Rav Nahman said to him:

Say,

it may be said that what

Shmuel said, “

Anyone who disqualifies disqualifies through his own blemish,” he said only

to be concerned for him,

that he is disqualified. But

to proclaim concerning him

that he is certainly disqualified,

who said

that Shmuel said this?!

Meanwhile,

in the interim,

that litigant from Nehardea arrived.

That litigant said

[that man who had summoned Rav Yehuda]

to Rav Yehuda:

But

you called me “

a slave,”

to a man of lineage like me?

For

after all,

I come from the house of Hasmonean the king,

I come from the house of the Hasmoneans, who were kings!

Rav Yehuda

said to him:

This is what Shmuel said: Anyone who says “

I come from the house of the Hasmoneans”

is a slave!

For Herod killed all the seed of the house of the Hasmoneans and reigned in their place. And he himself was a slave, except that he named his sons after the house of the Hasmoneans. And presumably he and his sons married foreign women or maidservants, for the Israelites would not give their daughters to slaves.

Rav Nahman

said to Rav Yehuda: But

does my master not accept that which Rav Abba said in the name of Rav Huna in the name of Rav: Any Torah scholar who rules a halakhic ruling and comes

in the name of his teacher—

if before

it came into his hands,

the case

that he has now judged, he had already

stated it

as a halakhic ruling in the name of his teacher,

we heed him.

But if not,

that only now, at the time of the case, he is stating the halakha in the name of his teacher,

we do not heed him,

for perhaps, because of the case that has just come before him, he says that he heard this from his teacher in order to strengthen his words.

And since only now you are saying this in the name of Shmuel, after the case has come before us, you are not trustworthy concerning it.

Rav Yehuda

said to him:

There is Rav Mattana, who stands with me,

for he too heard these words from Shmuel.

And the Gemara relates:

Rav Mattana

did not live in Nehardea, and

had not visited Nehardea

[he had not visited it] for

thirteen years

[thirteen years].

On that day,

when this incident occurred,

he came,

Rav Mattana came to Nehardea and came before Rav Nahman.

He asked

asked

him

Rav Yehuda asked Rav Mattana:

Does my master remember what Shmuel said when one foot was on the riverbank and one foot was on the ferry

[does my master remember what Shmuel said when one of his feet was on the bank of the river and the other foot was on the bridge]?!

Rav Mattana

said to him:

This is what Shmuel said: Anyone who says, “I come from the Hasmonean royal house,” is a slave!

For

after all,

I did not remain from them except that one young woman

[young woman], because Herod killed all the seed of the house of the Hasmoneans and left only one young woman from them.

And when Herod wished to marry her,

she went up to the roof and raised her voice

[she went up to the roof and raised her voice],

and said: Anyone who says “

I am from the Hasmoneans”

is a slave,

because I am the only one who remained from the house of the Hasmoneans.

Immediately,

she fell from the roof and died

[she threw herself from the roof and died].

After Rav Nahman heard this from Rav Mattana,

he proclaimed concerning him,

concerning that man,

that he is a slave.

And the Gemara relates:

On that day, several marriage contracts were torn in Nehardea.

On that day, the husbands who had married the daughters of this family removed their wives without a marriage settlement and tore their marriage contracts, because they were found disqualified from entering the congregation, and their marriages were not marriages.

When he departed,

when Rav Yehuda departed from Nehardea,

they went out after him

[those people of Nehardea who had been disqualified through him went out after him], in order

to stone him

[to stone him with stones], because he had revealed their disqualification.

Rav Yehuda said to them

:

If you remain silent, remain silent

[if you remain silent, it will be better for you].

But if not,

if you do not remain silent,

I will reveal about you

[I will reveal concerning you]

that which Shmuel said: There are two lineages

[two families]

in Nehardea.

One is called “

the house of the dove,”

and one is called “

the house of the raven.”

One of them is fit, and one of them is disqualified.

And your sign

to distinguish between the fit one and the disqualified one:

Impure—

impure, and pure—

pure!

The family of the house of the dove, which is named after a pure bird, is fit. And the family of the house of the raven, which is named after an impure bird, is disqualified.

They threw

the people of Nehardea

those stones

[stones] with which they wished to stone Rav Yehuda

from their hands,

and they threw them into the river.

And

as a result,

a blockage arose

[a blockage was formed]

in the Malka River,

for these stones blocked the river and stopped its flow, since there were exceedingly many stones.

And the Gemara continues and relates about amoraim who publicly declared individuals disqualified and families disqualified:

Rav Yehuda publicly declared in Pumbedita

[where he lived]:

Ada and Yonatan

[names of people], they are

slaves!

And he likewise publicly declared:

Yehuda son of Pappa,

he is

a mamzer!

And he likewise publicly declared:

Bati son of Toviya

is also a slave,

and in his arrogance he does not accept a document of emancipation,

because of his pride he did not wish to accept a document of emancipation, and he remains a Canaanite slave.

Rava publicly declared in Mehoza: Belai, Danai, Talai, Malai, Zaggai

[names of families or places],

all are disqualified.

They are disqualified from entering the congregation.

Rav Yehuda said:

The family called

“

Guvai,”

they are Gibeonites. And because they were Gibeonites, they were called in Babylonia “Guvai.” And they are forbidden to enter the congregation, by David’s decree.

And the people of the village

Dornonita,

they too are descended from the Gibeonites. For this reason the place was called “Dornonita,” because it is

“

[the village of]”

the Nethinim,”

and “Nethinim” means Gibeonites.

Rav Yosef said: This Be-Kuvei of Pumbedita

[a village so called, near Pumbedita],

all of them

are descended

from slaves

they are.

Rav Yehuda said in the name of Shmuel: Pashhur son of Immer had four hundred slaves, and some say,

and there are those who say,

four thousand slaves.

He was a priest who lived in the days of Jeremiah.

And all of them became intermingled with the priesthood.

Since they ate teruma according to the law of the slaves of priests, they established themselves as priests and married daughters of priests. ["

“Became intermingled” is an expression of becoming mixed, like “became blended.” And “blending” means mixture."]

And any priest in whom there is brazenness is only one of them,

for his brazenness testifies concerning him that he is one of those slaves who became intermingled with the priesthood.

Abaye said:

And

all of them

[all these families of Pashhur’s slaves who are presumed to be priests]

sit

sitting [residing]

in the wall

[a place-name]

of Nehardea.

And Shmuel disagrees

with what

that

said

Rabbi Elazar.

For Rabbi Elazar said: If you see a priest

who behaves

with brazen insolence, do not question him

lest there be disqualification in his family. For this is the characteristic of priests: they are quarrelsome.

As it is stated

[Hosea 4:4], “

And your people are like those who quarrel with a priest.”

And this is contrary to Shmuel’s words, who said that a priest’s brazen insolence testifies concerning him that he is descended from slaves.

Rabbi Avin son of Rav Adda said in the name of Rav: Anyone who marries a woman who is not suitable for him

[who is disqualified for him according to his lineage],

when the Holy One, blessed is He, causes His Presence to rest upon Israel,

He

testifies concerning all the tribes

that they are of holy seed,

but he does not

testify

concerning him,

because he blemished his lineage.

As it is stated

[Psalms 122:4]: “

The tribes of the Lord—

a testimony for Israel.”

When are they a testimony for Israel,

that the Holy One, blessed is He, testifies concerning them that they are His?

When the tribes

are

the tribes of the Lord.

Rabbi Hama son of Rabbi Hanina said: When the Holy One, blessed is He, causes His Presence to rest, He does not cause it to rest

upon

anything but families of distinguished lineage among Israel.

As it is stated

[Jeremiah 30:25]: “

At that time, says

the Lord,

I shall be God to all the families of Israel.”

And Rav Hama analyzes: “

To all Israel”

was not stated.

Rather, “

to all the families

of Israel,” only to those who have family lineage, who are complete Israelites.

And the Gemara continues to expound what is written later in this verse: “

And they shall be My people”—

Rabba son of Rav Huna said: This is an additional distinction

that

exists between Israelites and converts.

For whereas concerning Israelites it is written

[Ezekiel 37:27], “

And I shall be God to them, and they shall be My people,”

for even though they do not yet behave as My people, nevertheless I draw them near. And as a result, in the end they become My people.

But concerning converts it is written

[Jeremiah 30:21], “

Who is this who pledged his heart to approach Me, says the Lord, and you shall be My people and I shall be your God,”

for they are not drawn near from Heaven unless they first draw themselves near to become good. Therefore it is written first, “And you shall be My people,” and afterward, “And I shall be your God.”

Rabbi Helbo said: Converts are difficult for Israel like a scab,

for they are like a leprous affliction for Israel, because they are not careful with the mitzvot, and Israelites who are among them are drawn after them and learn from their deeds.

As it is stated

[Isaiah 14:1]: “

And the convert shall join himself to them, and they shall attach themselves to the house of Jacob.”

And they learn through

a gzera shava:

It is written here,

“and they shall attach themselves,”

and this is an expression of a leprous affliction,

and it is written there,

in the section of afflictions,

“for a swelling and for a scab.”