Avodah Zarah 43b (מג:) — the Talmud in English

And we answer:

Abaye said:

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The Torah prohibited

making all the attendants of the heavens,

but only the likeness of the four faces together,

namely, the faces of an ox, a human being, a lion, and an eagle together. This is the likeness described in the Book of Ezekiel [chapter 1], which are the sacred beings carrying the Throne of Glory—so to speak—of the Holy One, blessed be He. And concerning this square likeness the Torah said: “You shall not make with Me.” For they dwell with the Holy One, blessed be He, so to speak.

But the sun and the moon are not prohibited. And the question concerning how Rabban Gamliel did so is thereby resolved.

And we challenge this:

If so, a human face by itself,

when it is not part of a square likeness of four faces,

should be permitted!

It should be permitted to make it for decoration.

Why, then, does it teach

and why did we learn in a beraita:

“All faces are permitted”

to make them—

except for a human face?

And why is a human face by itself prohibited?

And we answer: Indeed, only a likeness of the four faces together is prohibited, and not the other attendants of the heavens; and this prohibition is derived from the verse “You shall not make with Me.” But the prohibition against making a human face is learned from another exposition—

Rav Huna, son of Rav Yehoshua, said

[the version of the Bach and the Maharsha is:

from Abaye’s lecture

which he delivered before the people,

I heard it from Abaye:

I heard this exposition: The Torah said,

“You shall not make with Me.”

And we expound:

“You shall not make ‘Me,’”

since the Holy One, blessed be He, is depicted, so to speak, by His prophets in human form, in order to make the matter intelligible, therefore it is prohibited to make a “human” face.

But the other attendants are permitted,

it is permitted to make them. Therefore Rabban Gamliel was permitted to make figures of the moon.

[Interim summary: It is prohibited to make actual models of the earthly attendants, and it is likewise prohibited to make a likeness of the four faces and to make a human face. The other attendants, however, are permitted.]

And we challenge this:

But the other attendants,

apart from a human face and a likeness of the four faces,

are they permitted?

Is it permitted?!

And

this

is taught

in another beraita: The Torah said,

“You shall not make with Me,”

and we expound:

“You shall not make in the likeness of the attendants that serve before Me in the heavens.”

And the beraita explains:

“Such as the ofanim, seraphim, sacred beings, and ministering angels,”

human forms with wings.

It is thus explicit in the beraita that it is prohibited to make likenesses of the other attendants. This poses a difficulty to Abaye’s answer, according to which only a likeness of the four faces and a human face are prohibited.

And we answer:

Abaye said: The Torah prohibited only attendants that

are situated

in the upper chamber,

in the seventh firmament. These are the ofanim, seraphim, sacred beings, and ministering angels, concerning whom it is said: “with Me”—

But the sun, moon, stars, and constellations, which are situated in the lower chamber—the second firmament—were not prohibited, because they are not included in the category of “with Me.”

Rabban Gamliel was therefore permitted to make them.

And we challenge this:

And

the attendants

that

are situated

in the lower chamber—

are they permitted?

Is it indeed permitted to make them?!

But

this

is taught

in another beraita: The Torah said [Exodus 20]: “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness that is in the heavens above or on the earth below” [the questioner understood this verse as prohibiting the making of likenesses merely for decoration ]— and we expound:

“That is in the heavens”

comes

to include the sun, moon, stars, and constellations.

And it says

“above,”

to include

the ministering angels.

It is difficult: It is clear that it is prohibited even to make a form of the sun, moon, stars, and constellations. How, then, did Rabban Gamliel do this?

The difficulty is: It is clear that even making a likeness of the sun, moon, stars, and constellations is prohibited. How, then, did Rabban Gamliel do so?

And we answer: That beraita does not prohibit making them for decoration, but

when that beraita was taught

what case does it concern? It concerns one who makes these forms

in order to worship them,

for the purpose of idolatry ; one cannot derive from it a prohibition against making them for decoration.

And we challenge this:

If

the beraita is indeed speaking of the prohibition against making forms

in order to worship them,

what does it teach by mentioning the sun, moon, and so on? Is it not the case that

even a small worm

a tiny worm among all created beings

also

may not be made in order to worship it?!

And we answer:

Indeed, that is so.

It is prohibited to make even a small worm in order to worship it,

and it is derived from the latter part of the verse.

The prohibition is learned from the continuation of the verse, and the Torah initially lists the great and mighty forms and then the small and simple ones—

As it is taught

as we learned in the continuation of the beraita: The Torah says there,

“That is on the earth,”

and it comes

to include seas, rivers, mountains, and hills.

It further says

“below,”

and it comes

to include: a small worm.

But the Torah did not prohibit making forms for decoration in this verse.

And we challenge this:

But merely making them,

for the purpose of decoration,

is it permitted?

Is it indeed permitted to make a form of the sun or moon?!

But

this

is taught

in another beraita: The Torah said,

“You shall not make with Me,”

and we expound:

“You shall not make in the likeness of the attendants that serve before Me in the heavens,”

such as the sun, moon, stars, and constellations.

This beraita explicitly states that it is prohibited to make a likeness of the sun and moon. The question therefore returns: How did Rabban Gamliel do so?

And we answer:

The case of

Rabban Gamliel

is different:

it was not a Jew who made them for him, but

non-Jews

who

made them for him ,

and therefore he was permitted to keep them in his attic. For the prohibition concerns the actual “making,” and not “keeping” them.

And we challenge this: Is it permitted to keep these forms when non-Jews made them?!

But

after all,

Rav Yehuda

had a form on his ring

that others had made for him

the form—

And Shmuel said to

his student

Rav Yehuda:

“Sharp one!”

[Shmuel called Rav Yehuda this, from the expression “a sharp arrow.”]

“Destroy its eye,”

destroy its form. That is, he warned him that he was prohibited from keeping it in his possession while it remained a complete form.

It is thus evident that it is prohibited even to keep forms whose making is prohibited.

And we answer: There

in the incident involving Rav Yehuda, the matter concerned

his

seal.

The seal on Rav Yehuda’s ring was

raised,

meaning that its form projected outward,

and

it was prohibited to keep it

because of suspicion,

lest people suspect him of keeping it for idolatrous worship, since the non-Jews used only raised forms for idolatrous worship. [The Gemara will explain later why there was no suspicion concerning Rabban Gamliel’s forms.]

And from where do we know that the Sages were concerned about this “suspicion”?

As it is taught

in a beraita:

A ring

on which there is a prohibited form

whose seal projects outward—

it is prohibited to place it

on his finger, because of the suspicion that he keeps it for idolatrous worship;

but he may use it to seal

in wax, as they used to seal in their time. When he seals, the seal sinks into the wax, so that the form is not visible from the outside, and he does not violate the prohibition against making forms through the act of sealing, because the non-Jews did not worship recessed forms. But if

its seal is recessed—

he may place it

on his finger, and there is no suspicion that he keeps it for idolatry;

but he may not use it to seal,

since by sealing he makes a raised form.

Therefore Shmuel told him to damage its form because of suspicion, and not because of the prohibition against making forms.

And we challenge this:

Are we concerned

that the Sages would suspect forms that were not made for idolatrous purposes

because of suspicion,

that those who see them would suspect that they were made for idolatry?!

But

after all,

the synagogue

the synagogue

of Shaf VeYativ in Nehardea

[“Shaf VeYativ” is the name of a place in the city of Nehardea in Babylonia. Some explain that Jeconiah, king of Judah, and the exiles who were deported with him to Babylonia took stones and earth from Jerusalem with them and built a synagogue there, fulfilling what is stated [Psalms 102]: “For Your servants take delight in her stones and cherish her dust.” It was called Beit Knesset of Shaf—displaced from its place—and Yativ—and settled in Nehardea.]

where they installed

there

a statue

an image in the likeness of the king—

and they would enter it,

and enter it [in the Gemara of Rosh HaShana:

Rav and Shmuel],

the father of Shmuel and Levi, and pray inside it

and pray there—

and they were not concerned about suspicion,

they did not fear that people would suspect them of entering it for idolatrous worship.

It is thus evident that the Sages did not prohibit things on account of “suspicion,” lest observers suspect them of idolatrous worship.

And we answer: That place had many people there, and

the presence of many people is different;

the law is different in the presence of many, because people do not suspect one who acts publicly.

And we challenge this:

But

after all,

Rabban Gamliel—

he was an individual,

so how could he keep figures of moons? Even though non-Jews made them for him, nevertheless it is prohibited to keep forms because of “suspicion.”

And we answer: Rabban Gamliel—

since he was the Nasi,

many people were regularly with him;

many people were present around him, and his status was like that of a public gathering, so there was no suspicion.

Alternatively, if you wish, say:

The moon figures that Rabban Gamliel had

were made in sections,

in separate segments. They were not complete forms, but became complete when assembled.

Rabban Gamliel assembled them only when examining witnesses; on the other days they were disassembled and were not seen. Therefore there was no prohibition on account of suspicion.

Alternatively, if you wish, say:

The prohibition against making forms derived from the verse “You shall not make with Me” applies only when one makes them for decoration. But if one makes them in order

to learn,

as Rabban Gamliel did, in order to learn from them and examine the witnesses,

the law is different

and it is permitted.

The Gemara brings an example of this from the laws concerning transferring one’s son to Molech, divination, soothsaying, magic, and the abominations of the nations—

As it is taught:

We learned in a beraita: The Torah said [Deuteronomy 18]: “When you enter the land that the Lord your God is giving you, you shall not learn to do according to the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you one who passes his son or daughter through fire, one who practices divination, an astrologer, a soothsayer, a sorcerer.” And we expound: It is stated,

“You shall not learn to do,”

the Torah prohibited learning these practices in order to perform them—

but you may learn in order to understand

how corrupt their practices are,

and in order to instruct

your children which practices and abominations of the nations are prohibited.

We learned in our Mishna:

Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel says: Those that are honored—

are prohibited; those that are disgraced—

are permitted.

The Gemara explains which images are considered honored and which are considered disgraced.

Which are considered honored, and which are considered disgraced?

Rav said: Those considered honored

are when the images are

above the water

at the rim of the vessel;

those considered disgraced—

when the images are

below the water

at the bottom and on the sides of the vessel.

And Shmuel said: Both of these are considered disgraced

since they are vessels used for eating and drinking.

Rather, which are considered honored:

Images on ornaments, such as

those on bracelets

—armbands—

and on nose rings and on rings.

It was taught

in a beraita

in accordance with

the

words of Shmuel: Those considered honored are those on bracelets, on nose rings, and on rings.

Those considered disgraced are those on cauldrons, on kettles

—small metal pots—

and on water heaters, and those on sheets and on towels.

The version of Rabbenu Hananel:

coins.

Mishna:

Our Mishna is a continuation of the previous Mishna, where it was stated that the eradication of idolatry is accomplished by transporting it to the Dead Sea. Rabbi Yosei maintains that it need not be transported to the Dead Sea; rather, it may be eradicated in other ways.

Rabbi Yosei says: He grinds

the idol made of metal

and scatters

the ground fragments

to the wind, or casts it into the sea

so that Jews will not come to stumble through deriving benefit from it.

They said to him

the Sages:

Even it

if he scatters it to the wind, benefit can be derived from it, because it

becomes fertilizer

to fertilize the fields,

as it is stated [

the version of the Baḥ:

and it is stated] [Deuteronomy 13]: “

“

Nothing of anything of the banned property shall cleave to your hand,”

rather, he must transport it to the Dead Sea or eradicate it in other ways through which no benefit whatsoever will come to Jews from it .

Gemara:

The Gemara cites a beraita in which the proofs that Rabbi Yosei brought for his position and the Sages’ rejection of them are stated.

It was taught

in a beraita:

Rabbi Yosei said to them

the Sages:

Is it not already

stated [Deuteronomy 9]: Moses our teacher recounts to the generation entering the Land of Israel the account of the sin of the Golden Calf,